Comments on: Senate Bill 3-What Went Wrong And How to Fix it http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/ Just another Sustainablewnc.org weblog Sun, 06 Jul 2008 20:15:49 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: Steve Owen http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-45 Steve Owen Fri, 31 Aug 2007 19:28:11 +0000 http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-45 Quick note here to say add my name to Avram's camp on this issue. Cooptation within the movement is to be expected, and that's why we need to strengthen this counter discourse. There's plenty to suggest that the assumption of growth just isn't going to be supported over time if we impose a few sound axioms of sustainability on the analysis. Howard Odom and others made nice critiques of this in the 1970's. I'd be interested in participating in an ongoing dialogue about this. Thanks for the leadership on it, Avram. Quick note here to say add my name to Avram’s camp on this issue. Cooptation within the movement is to be expected, and that’s why we need to strengthen this counter discourse. There’s plenty to suggest that the assumption of growth just isn’t going to be supported over time if we impose a few sound axioms of sustainability on the analysis. Howard Odom and others made nice critiques of this in the 1970’s. I’d be interested in participating in an ongoing dialogue about this. Thanks for the leadership on it, Avram.

]]> By: Dot http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-16 Dot Wed, 08 Aug 2007 21:08:31 +0000 http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-16 Nice thoughtful piece. The per capita energy usage in Western Europe is 150 MBTU, in Japan it is 175 MBTU, and in the US it is 343 MBTU. Obviously we CAN reduce our energy consumption, and as you argue so clearly, we also must. China with 40 MBTU per capita and India with only 13 MBTU per capita have 2 billion people combined and they are headed our way! Nice thoughtful piece. The per capita energy usage in Western Europe is 150 MBTU, in Japan it is 175 MBTU, and in the US it is 343 MBTU. Obviously we CAN reduce our energy consumption, and as you argue so clearly, we also must. China with 40 MBTU per capita and India with only 13 MBTU per capita have 2 billion people combined and they are headed our way!

]]> By: avram http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-12 avram Mon, 06 Aug 2007 19:59:49 +0000 http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-12 Wally, Thanks for taking the time to read this long post. And thanks for the crucial work you do, as well, without which this blog, MAIN and WPVM wouldn't exist. Yes, this debate is long overdue and it's at the core of any meaningful effort to slow down or reverse the human impact on climate change. I would personally welcome the opportunity to publicly debate this issue with one or more members of the environmental community who are pushing agendas based on the presumption of increased future energy consumption. Avram Wally,
Thanks for taking the time to read this long post. And thanks for the crucial work you do, as well, without which this blog, MAIN and WPVM wouldn’t exist.

Yes, this debate is long overdue and it’s at the core of any meaningful effort to slow down or reverse the human impact on climate change. I would personally welcome the opportunity to publicly debate this issue with one or more members of the environmental community who are pushing agendas based on the presumption of increased future energy consumption.
Avram

]]> By: Wally http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-11 Wally Mon, 06 Aug 2007 14:50:17 +0000 http://avram.sustainablewnc.org/wp/2007/08/05/senate-bill-3-what-went-wrong-and-how-to-fix-it/#comment-11 Avram -- Thanks for all the hard work that you put into this, and thanks for your analysis. It sounds like there needs to be a debate within the sustainability community about whether or not increased energy consumption is inevitable -- if we are ever going to have a consensus about moving forward with real reform. Your thoughts? wally Avram — Thanks for all the hard work that you put into this, and thanks for your analysis.

It sounds like there needs to be a debate within the sustainability community about whether or not increased energy consumption is inevitable — if we are ever going to have a consensus about moving forward with real reform. Your thoughts?

wally

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